(Use buss/feeder lines to distribute power.) IF the Engineer is the guy that drives the locomotive then theTechnician must be the fireman is this correct? LGB throttles 51070, 52120 and 52121 will all work with the 50061 and other LGB transformers. Many manufacturers assemble cases with special screws to prevent access to the inside and accidental shock. This works for command control layouts too, since those parked trains are still drawing some current. The new Lionel ZW-L is getting a lot of good reviews and is a very powerful transformer for most layouts. However, if you begin adding more than 1 or 2 cars, be sure to get some extra track, or your longer train will be chasing its tail very quickly. As your needs grow, you can employ a larger transformer of fixed voltage. Extending the Reach of Your Power Some great beginner accessories are the #12052 Fastrack Highway Signal set, which is a set of highway signals that blink as the train goes by. Sign-up for email today! Atlas and Bachmann have the same transformers with 80 watt outputs as well that get good reviews and would be appropriate for a smaller layout. We use cookies to ensure that we give you the best experience on our website. Price Received. Number 24 to Number20 wire will all work with most layouts. The power supply that comes with these sets is usually a very small wall pack plug-in that cannot be easily expanded. There is no reason why your Lionel ZWs and Flyer big ones cant be used to run AC-powered trains of any vintage new or old. Its a good transformer. Actually the choice of transformer is secondary to the choice of control systems since you can operate O gauge trains with most any good modern transformer. Retrofitting a subway line into existing benchwork - and are subway sets still being made? While it is tempting to go with the biggest wire possible to guarantee excess capacity, there are drawbacks to putting in more than you need. There are many advantages in repairing or reconditioning your transformers. When they were manufactured by The American Flyer Manufacturing Company, they were made in Standard Gauge and a version of "O" gauge. On a large loop of track you will need to have multiple drops, hook-ups, to the transformer because if you only have one hook up the train will get slower the father away it gets from the transformer. The Lionel 1033 can be used for small or medium-sized layouts. The choice of a control system is somewhat, but not necessarily, dependent on which manufacturers engines you prefer or have the most of. The whistle requires more power than the outfits that don't have it. Older transformers I had this issue with are RW, 1033, KW, ZW.newer transformers were all made by MTH. These bus wires are often more important than the size of the power supply itself in getting good results. If your going to run anything more that what came with the set then you should probably upgrade to something a little bigger. Price Received. They give a great deal of power in a single handled transformer, and if you run trains along with another person, it can be more convenient for you to both have a smaller transformer than for two people to huddle around a larger KW or ZW transformer and share its handles. If you want a transformer with power to spare go get a ZW! This type of transformer is cheap, its reliable, and its easy to find. Please see our article on Fastrack here for more information. This conserves the trains' power supply for their needs and makes troubleshooting much easier. Digital command control systems (DCC) uses digital information to control the electrical power to the train. Ryan Kunkle is a nationally recognized professional model train expert and writer with over 25 years of experience. Use the CW-80 Transformer only for its intended purpose. Ive talked more about the Lionel RW and the LW as well. I thought you wanted information related to your layout not operations at a trains show. View More! I recently read an article/product review in the OGR magazine for the new Lioneltransformerand wassurprisedto learn that not all voltage outputwave-formsare created equal (pure sine wave versus some type of clipped sine wave). Yes, but the train will probably run too fast, depending on the output voltage of the transformer. Lionel Postwar 1033 Transformer Watch on A while back, approximately 2 weeks ago while running two very lengthy loops of fast track an old transformer nearly fried (50 years old) one of my wires that I was running to my Fastrac. Willoughby, Ohio - the home of the CP & E RR. The transformer included with your starter set should be adequate to handle a modest expansion of your train set discussed above. It will require a minimum of 108' of track just to do a basic rectangle before I add any switches, etc. Sign up for new product releases, promotions, and more. DCC is less common in starter sets, but some are available. Lionel 1033 Transformer Renovation Part I Peter Fenzel 306 subscribers Subscribe 11K views 3 years ago Lionel 1033 Transformer gets cleaned up, a new power cord, a new whistle rectifier. If you add a lot of track and find that your train slows down as it gets farther from your transformer, you will need to run jumper wires to the opposite side of your track layout. Problem with Rail King Protocol Sounds reversing unit, My D-190 Back in Action After Move to to NC, Caboose Identification - late era vintage, Continuing Saga Newtown Hardwrare House WIP. Again, if you have a very long run between switches, going a little larger is less likely to cause problems with voltage loss. Transformer capacity is rated in KVA (kilo-volt-amperes). I paid $75 + shipping for mine a year ago. Lionel makes two expansion sets for this purpose. A starter set is the best way to start with the train hobby. What about removing flanges from diesel wheels? Best bang for the buck for command are the Lionel 180W Powerhouse bricks IMO. Fortunately, there is an easy way to tell these cars apart, and the key is the numbers Lionel assigns to them. My question is.how big of a transformer will I need to power this thing? Most recommend the TPCs over the powermasters The CW 80 will work to begin with. The motor takes electricity through a small wire attached to a metal wheel that rests on the middle rail underneath. Tech Support for the OGR Forum (NOT FOR TRAINS), PRR fellas!lets build an S2!! Classification/marker lights on the PRR steam engine, For Sale: Lionel 6-11127 Legacy Southern Pacific GS-4 Daylight, Lionel Bethlehem Steel slag car and ATLAS NYC Baggage car, Lionel O 2333790 TrainWorld & RBP Trains Chris Raines -Exclusive - Katy LEGACY ES44AC #2021, Converting MTH Rail king GS-4 PROTO 2 to ERR Cruise Commander, The Harpers Ferry Layout II - Backdrop panels completed. Get DIY project ideas and easy-to-follow crafts to help you spruce up your space. The polarities can be reversed to change the direction of the train. The wire can also be purchased as solid or stranded. For a classic setup of a single freight train running on a 48 (or smaller) sheet of plywood, a 90-watt Lionel 1033 or 1044 is an excellent choice. As time goes on you can add higher wattage bricks one by one. Lionel developed and perfected its model designs and layouts during the Pre-War Era (1901-1942). Buyers truly want all-original trains that have never been tampered with. Ryan developsmodeltrainlayouts for public andprivate display. I would check yoour connections and wire size, just to be safe. For a classic setup of a single freight train running on a 48 sheet of plywood, a 90 watt Lionel 1033 or 1042 is an excellent choice. Get updates and special offers via email from Trains.com brands! This is why my wife loves me so. --Heck, watching one train run is great, Ill bet TWO would be even more fun! The Best Technical and Innovative Podcasts you should Listen, Essay Writing Service: The Best Solution for Busy Students, 6 The Best Alternatives for WhatsApp for Android, The Best Solar Street Light Manufacturers Across the World, Ultimate packing list while travelling with your dog. I'm guessing the MTH Z1000 is around $100 and the other suggestions are much more expensive. Of all the questions fielded by the staff of Classic Toy Trains, inquiries regarding layout wiring top the list.While you might expect numerous questions regarding complex techniques or new technologies, CTT. These small power supplies are designed to supply a few amps of power. Both are lighted. If the second digit is 9, it could be either, so be careful when considering one of them. Needless to say the "Spring into Spring" train show very nearly became unsprung! Lionel, LLC continued to manufacture and market trains and accessories in O scale under the Lionel brand and S gauge under the American Flyer brand. THE BASICS "O", "S", "HO". I've read that it is good practice to add feeders every 10 sections of track or sothat seems like a lot but I suppose that beats having "dead" spots in the track. Never had a problem. It's expensive, but the same factors that drove KW prices down are also driving ZW prices down. A lot of people are using the MTH Z1000's who have smaller layouts while others have moved up to the MTH Z4000. If you are using only LEDs for lighting, you could get away with even less. As your layout grows so, too, will its power demand. Mike to the forum. Lionel is also introducing a new 180 watt transformer to accompany the 80 watt CW 80. All power supplies will be rated for volts, amps, and watts. $7.89 delivery Feb 2 - 6. M3103. As you progress with your layout there are a lot of people here who will help you with any questions you have. Number 26 to 20 wire (depending on the length of your bus) will be sufficient for most applications. Smaller feeder wires are used to bridge the small gap from the bus to the track. My layout I am building is 5 sheets of 4x8 plywood and it will probaly take me 100 years to build it (I hope I have that much time left). If the transformer fails, you most likely have a short or overload somewhere in the control circuit. Because of this, like with lighting and accessories, your power supply and wiring for switch machines do not need to be as robust. Good choices are the Lionel 32923 Accessory Transformer, or another 80-watt transformer like the one included in your set, #14198. Then the K's will do siding and switching yard duty. Within that range, it is generally recommended to go for the most robust power supply possible. That might work, but it's probably borderline, especially if you are using something like a 1033 transformer that tops out at 16 volts. That could also be the reason the other transformers don't work. Make sure you are getting the right type of power supply for your layout. This is because the demands for power are becoming more than your transformer can handle. But were talking the trains that are in the absolute best condition and might not have ever run on the track. It can run four tracks at one time, so you layout can grow. Do not use this device if water is present. If you were to get a ZW 275 you need external short protection. Ive talked more about the KW here. If you like fixing things, fixing an old transformer is rewarding. Lionel Ready-to-Play is a large sized train that's made to be affordable and easy-to-use for both kids and adults alike. the amount of track is not what is important here. I went to mth Z1000, jason's train shop has the best price's I have seen for these. Reverse the above if planning to run mostly Lionel and go with the Lionel command system, either the full Legacy system or the upcoming CAB-1L and just add a Track Power Controller and a cable to run most MTH engines in conventional with the Lionel systems. Below weve listed these transformers in numerical order in the Numerical Index. If the system's train transformer is run in Europe with a step-down transformer alone (converting only voltage from 230V to 115V AC at a 50 Hz), it may not operate as intended. The only time you might not get your full moneys worth is during operation of locomotives equipped with Lionels TMCC or MTHs DCS command-control systems. Lionel CW80's can be found for around $50 at Greenberg and other train shows. It was one of Lionel's more venerable postwar products, lasting on the market for 18 years from 1948 to 1966. This is where the Lionel transformer comparisons should begin. This means that you will have about.5 volt drop if your train draws 5 amperes. 10 Easy Ways to Improve a Christmas Train Display, Wiring a Model Railroad for Block Operation, How to Build and Wire Reverse Loops for Model Trains, How to Choose the Right Transformer for Your Model Trains, Compatibility of Different Model Train Brands, HO Scale Track Plans for Model Train Layouts, buildings, streets, and other scenic accessories. I can remember a time when a Lionel ZW would set you back $275. Although all Lionel cars operate on O Gauge track, the bodies of the cars are made in two slightly different sizes. These systems still require a power supply but it only needs to supply a constant voltage to the rails. Adding lights to buildings, streets, and other scenic accessories usually do not require anywhere near the amperage demand of the trains themselves. The article you suggest would be a daunting task, as you'd have to gather virtually every known locomotive and transformer! Some systems will use bluetooth technology enabling you to control the trains with your tablet or cell phone. Number 22 solid wire works best on most scales. The smaller the number, the larger the wire. --Toy Train Collecting and Operating, by John Grams. electronically controlled outputs. In the middle range, Lionel made a lot of other transformers. A: According to Lionel's head of customer service, on the underside of their CW80 transformers, starting in late 2009, the vendor applied a sticker that states "QC50" on it. Twin coil machines have a higher current draw when in motion but are also much faster-acting than the motorized versions. Most feeders will be only a few inches long so the smaller diameter wire will not be a problem. Smaller layouts (a typical 4 foot by 8 foot being a good example) can usually get by with Number16 since the length of the run from the power supply to the track is never more than a few feet. Because the runs are short and power demands so low, this fine wire poses no safety threat. Enter your e-mail address to subscribe to this blog and receive notifications of new posts by e-mail. Dave: That certainly qualifies, don't forget the anti-gun lobbyist with the picket sign's. VerticalScope Inc., 111 Peter Street, Suite 600, Toronto, Ontario, M5V 2H1, Canada. This thing has more power then I will ever need. I have one R transformer from which I run everything - but only 1 train at a time and a few accessories for a layout in a space about 24 by 10 ft. The same is true for other electronic projects around your layout and inside buildings, train cars, and even locomotives. If they do, follow their recommendations. So, if you want to connect eight landscape lights to an electronic transformer, and the lights use 20 watts each, you would need a 160 watt transformer. Lionel makes a seemingly infinite number of cars to in a variety of colors, types, and road names. In most cases, stranded wire is preferred because the multiple threads provide more conductivity and flexibility. A model railroad train set designed for use in the United States will have a 115V AC 60Hz power requirement. They run on three rail track. The transformer, when operated at the lower frequency, may . Remember, the only silly question is the one that you did not ask. I have a 3amp, 40watt transformer. The Lionel Multi-control 1033 is a 90 watt transformer produced from 1948 to 1956. Amperes = VA/Secondary Volts or 40VA/28V = 1.43 amperes. The smallest wire you can work with will be more than sufficient. Classic cars have a 5 or 6 as their second digit [25051, 16686, etc]. 10 Easy Ways to Improve a Christmas Train Display, Compatibility of Different Model Train Brands, How to Build and Wire Reverse Loops for Model Trains, Wiring a Model Railroad for Block Operation, Wire Gauge Standards for Model Train Layouts, Model Train Track Grades and Maximum Grade Issues. It is best to use at least two different colors for your track wiring (one for each rail). Members enjoy 15% off any purchase in our store. --I need a station for the train to stop at. However, in the future if you continue in the hobby and your roster expands you may acquire motive power which requires larger curves than what came with your set. I have a post war ZW and a KW and a Z, all three are good transformers, just meant for differant needs. In most cases, stranded wire is preferred because the multiple threads provide more conductivity and flexibility. As you can see, a lot of great helpers here. Lionel made a lot of other transformers over the years. In most cases, because we are dealing with relatively low voltage and amperage and in a normally stable temperature and humidity climates, our wiring does not require any extra insulation. The old transformer is not really the problem, the problem is the supply wire, particularly under heavyload (or derailment without the benefit of a quicker breaker). Transformers are sized by determining the total load required (in amps). You can also run Lionel TMCC/Legacy Command Engines using the MTH DCS system with the addition of a Lionel command base and an additional cable. Multi-conductor wires with many strands of finer wire are more common for telecommunications and electronics. The least expensive power supply you should consider is the Lionel CW80 Transformer; you can buy a new one for about $150 or a used on one eBay for about $60. CW80 Transformer. Get the Classic Toy Trains newsletter delivered to your inbox twice a month, Calculating transformer size for layout size. Pretty much suffered the same fate, too. Past,presentand future. Lionel uses red and black (red always for the center rail, black for the two outer rails) as a standard in its instructions and most 3-Rail O Gauge layouts are probably wired this way. Been there, done that. Ive written more about the Lionel ZW here. Its expensive, but the same factors that drove KW prices down are also driving ZW prices down. What type is your old transformer? The 1044 is just a 1033 in a different case. For a classic setup of a single freight train running on a 48 (or smaller) sheet of plywood, a 90-watt Lionel 1033 or 1044 is an excellent choice. Hello, I'm new to this site, and completely new to toy trains also - so please pardon my ignorance! Get the Classic Toy Trains newsletter delivered to your inbox twice a month, WELCOME TO THE FORUM Mike!! As the kit grows and you start putting in turnouts (or the point switching systems) to move your train from one track to another track, you will not only need more than 1 transformer, you will. And of course, individual Fastrack sections are also available. If you need a device that converts from different voltages so it can power another device, then a transformer will fulfill that role perfectly. Although not necessarily a mandated standard, white, black and or red are used for track power on most layouts - if for no other reason than these colors are easiest to find. Although I am an electrical engineer, I just add stuff until the transformer gets too warm and then I branch off and add another. You can also minimize voltage drop at the rail joints by soldering the rails together. Our transformer sizing calculator allows you to obtain the minimum single or three-phase transformer size required based on the load you need to power. The Lionel ZW has four sets of posts and six controls. Different wiring projects call for different standards. It is important to remember that the real test of the power supply is the load you'll place on it. The Lionel 1033 is a great choice for small or medium-sized layouts. Make sure you are getting the right type of power supply for your layout. They are fun to have. And if the power supply does fail, it is best not to repair it on your own. Most people start with a pre-packaged train set. Tales From Harmon Shops, WTB: LIONEL AUTRORACKS SPECIFICALLY SOUTHERN,GRAND TRUNK,BNSF,FERROMEX. You don't want to try to solder even Number 16 gauge wire right to your rails, however. I'm sure I'll need more help along the way, so I'll be checking back in with more silly questions! The Lionel ZW has four sets of posts and six controls. Wow.thanks for all the advice so far, guys!! Which Lionel transformer do I need? you ask? Add a PW dual motor F3 (4 amps) with 5 lighted cars (another 10 bulbs - 1 amp) and you are cooking (9 amps). (10 lights X . 5 years of Classic Toy Trains at your fingertips! Lionel made these for years and kept them in production under a different model number well into the 1970s because it was a reliable, dependable design and had enough power for a typical starter set while leaving some room to grow. Its a bargain at that price. It does not work with O27. Effort. Lionel makes two expansion sets for this purpose. Dang, this math makes my head hurt. And both of them give more wattage per handle than a KW or ZW. The first Lionel electric trains were powered by wet-cell batteries, which were, of course, dangerous. He directs production at Lionel, the premier model train manufacturer, and he istheformer president of theConrail HistoricalSociety. But a 12-gauge solid wire is one strand, while a 12-gauge stranded wire may be made up of more than a dozen much smaller individual strands spun together. The first is the traditional or classic size, which are the cars that match starter sets. Sell Your Trains Yourself On eBay. This diagram shows all of the controls and the pinout for the Lionel RW transformer. While better starter sets usually include a more robust transformer, as a general rule the power pack supplied with your starter set is just thata start. Just not quite as much. Frankly, its hard to go wrong with either of these transformers, especially at todays prices. A locomotive on a mile-long loop will draw as many amps as it does on a 4x8 platform. Over the years I have collected boxed (mostly liquor boxes) sets from attics.So I have a variety of transformers on hand. Use this index to see additional details about the individual transformers issued by Lionel during the post-war period. You can't count on a lack of compatibility issues for one Legacy locomotive being definitive for all Legacy locomotives, for example. If this happens, you will need another transformer to share the load. Right now I am running 8 motors on one KW [the new one I found] and got the old one for reserve. Daniel Defense firearms, parts and accessories, http://www.modeltrainforum.com/showthread.php?t=9670, http://www.modeltrainforum.com/album.php?u=2334, 14X16 Switching style [url]http://www.modeltrainforum.com/showthread.php?t=8241, https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCkMHvbckuBLo3pJN1FGE1Gg. The locomotives are battery-powered and made of durable plastic. The Lionel 1033 is a great choice for small or medium-sized layouts. This comes primarily from the locomotive(s) but also from lights and other accessories. Is there anyway of saying how much track it will power? If you're looking to only have one loop with multiple sidings then you'll only need 1 source of power for the whole layout. Now, I am going to make a suggesstion that you use a larger diameter curve for your corners. Also, I found an old guide printed by lionel on power requirements. It will require a minimum of 108' of track just to do a basic rectangle before I add any switches, etc. Never Enough Room, Time or Money for all the Trains! If you're experiencing problems with your wiring due to humidity, for example, you are going to face even greater issues with the trains and tracks themselves. Another classic is the Automatic Gateman. It also has an optional bell sound that can be turned on and off. The larger transformers could operate up to four trains independently. Some of the variables are obvious, others not so much. (using 4 of the 180 watt Lionel bricks) That's 10 amps per channel on all 4 channels. All of the transformers that have more than 90 Watts are in great demand today as more collectors are operating retro-layouts. If you add feeders to the track at the farthest point (remember to get the same wire to the same rails) you will not slow down at the farthest point. Just not quite as much. Get DIY project ideas and easy-to-follow crafts to help you spruce up your space. Used 1033's for sidings and the switching yard its self. It is not uncommon to see 50-year-old transformers still going strong on a model railroad. I had 3 lionel cw80's and two quit working. Whatever colors and pattern you choose, just make sure to keep a good notebook handy to reference later. By creating alternate routes, more complex loops, and storage tracks, your trains will suddenly be even more interesting to watch and they will begin providing you the feeling that they are going somewhere and that you are running a small railroad. I have noticed that my old transformers do not work well or not work at all with newer electronic whistle tenders. While those locomotives and their sound systems are designed to operate using conventional transformers like your ZW, digital controllers are needed to activate additional features like special sound effects and coupler activation. That means there are lots of them. A 10 amp breaker and 16 gauge wire would be appropriate for an old ZW. Electric Trains make great power supplies, depending on usage, on a DCS controlled layout. These are all good, dependable transformers from the postwar era that are easy to find today, have adequate wattages ranging from 90-270 watts, have a circuit breaker for safety and have a whistle controller. I really doubt you will need more than that. You may never use all the amps, but it's usually cheaper to grow into a power supply than to continually upgrade. God bless TCA 05-58541 Benefactor Member of theNRA, Member of the American Legion, Retired Boss Hog of Roseyville , KC&D Qualified. (Electrical Contractor with dear old Dad for 30 years) Regards Steve. Obviously, for a lot of people, the $700 Lionel ZW-L transformer is overkill.

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